Dear Secessionists: We’ll See Your Petition and Raise You

The next war between the states is apparently being fought online — although not all combatants are taking things seriously.

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WhiteHouse.gov

Petitioners from 40 states have asked to secede from the union.

One of the many great things thing about America’s grand experiment in democracy is that people are free to object to it. In the nine days since Nov. 6, more than 500,000 signatures from residents of all 50 states have appeared on petitions demanding the right to secede from the union in light of President Obama’s reelection.

Most of the requests, hosted on the White House’s “We The People” online petition website, ask that the President “peacefully grant the state of ______ [Maine, Texas, Wisconsin, etc.] to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government.” Some even quote the Declaration of Independence to support their argument.

Another great thing about America, however, is that people are free to make fun of each other — particularly of those citizens who appear to have skipped the fourth grade class when their teachers began the chapter on the Civil War. A series of anti-secessionist counter-petitions have sprung up on We The People, some with thousands of signatures, expressing support for the Union or demanding punishment for the would-be secessionists.

(COVER: For Obama, Survival Is the New Winning)

One anti-secession petition, with more than 17,000 signatures, requests that the government deport anyone who petitioned to leave in the first place. A second, with more than 10,000 signatures, asks that the signers be summarily stripped of citizenship and exiled.

A cooler-headed plea for understanding and unity has garnered more than 2,300 signatures:

Times have been tough for all of us; some states are frustrated to the point of petitioning for secession, but now is not the time to be divided.Their actions can only harm our country… We the undersigned implore the Administration to do everything in its power to keep our nation united.

Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state to secede from the USA shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.

And meanwhile, another 4,500 people have asked the president allow the state of Texas — where more than 100,000 people have signed a secession petition — to secede, as long as the city of Austin gets to stay part of America:

Austin Texas continues to suffer difficulties stemming from the lack of civil, religious, and political freedoms imposed upon the city by less liberally minded Texans. It is entirely feasible for Austin to operate as its own state, within the United States, in the event that Texas is successful in the current bid to secede.

Once the White House gets more than 25,000 signatures to a petition it has to take a serious look at it — although it’s not under any obligation to actually accede to petitioners’ demands. But the administration will send an e-mail to everyone who signed and submitted their e-mail address.

But plenty of petitioners would rather focus on the more important issues. More than 797 petitioners signed on to a proposal (since taken down) to recognize Texas A&M quarterback Johnny Manziel:

WHEREAS Johnny Manziel, also known as “Johnny Football” has ushered in an age of collegiate football in America the likes of which we have never seen…

…NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED THAT:

The Office of the President of the United States, and indeed the whole of the free world, endorses Johnny Manziel for the 2012 Heisman Trophy. Gig’em Aggies.

67 comments
johnnymorales
johnnymorales

People who live in a state DO NOT OWN the TERRITORY making up any state.

That goes for everyone newcomers and people whose family have lived in a state for generations.

The TERRITORY OF A STATE is OWNED BY THE USA.

The citizens of the USA who live in any of the 50 states are citizens of the USA.

NOT ONE single person in the USA is a Citizen of their state, because there is no such thing as being a citizen of a state that is equal to or superior in nature to being the citizen of the USA.

All such assertions reflect are "honorary". 

They do NOT reflect any sort of legal status recognized by the USA or any other nation.

Some people confuse RESIDENCY with citizenship.

But Residency does not equal or is it a form of CITIZENSHIP. Otherwise a person's status would NOT change simply by moving to another state.

Citizenship and the constitution do NOT give anyone the right to take property owned by the USA established by war and treaties as their own property. 

For that reason there is NO type of vote, NO type of declaration that can be made by people living any state that can legally create the basis for succession.

Of course then there is the fact that a significant minority, often a majority of a state has NO desire to succeed.

People who think their state has a right to succeed seem to believe those who don't agree have no rights at all, and can be forced to move somewhere else while they steal territory belonging to the USA under the guise of succession.

And that is what succession boils down to, an attempt to steal property belonging to the USA own in the name of all citizens by a few dissatisfied few.

scottyg991
scottyg991

This article deals with the First Amendment greatly, specifically with "the right of the people to petition the government for a redress of grievances". As citizens of the United States, the people of Texas, Maine, Wisconsin, etc. have a right to sign this petition for secession from the Union. Even though realistically this may be far from the solution to the economic problems that this country is dealing with, people still are constitutionally protected to write a petition and collect signatures. Although the anti-secession petitioners also have a right to petition for whatever they want, in some cases deportation of all people who are for the secession of certain states, I do not think that the government can deport people for simply expressing their first amendment rights. Why should people be stripped of their citizenship for expressing their freedom to petition the government? These secessionists are completely within their rights to create a petition, even if it is for the separation of the United States.

-Scott Gingras

epitygxanwn
epitygxanwn

@scottyg991 Nice try, but no. The Civil War established that there is no right to secede. Also, a petition to secede is not "for a redress of grievances".

Margery
Margery like.author.displayName 1 Like

Actually, I'm one of that group who would just as soon see the signers of the petition to leave our Union given required to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that their leaving the Union would be beneficial to their state and if they did not prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt, they should then be given another choice: they publicly advertise in their local paper how wrong they were to want to leave the Union or they lose their citizenship.   IMO, they actually don't deserve to live in a country that gives more rights to its citizens than any other country in the world.  To act as if it were some evil 3rd world country is a disgrace.

noneedtoaggress
noneedtoaggress

@Margery You do realize that the United States Government that you so lovingly speak of has killed massive numbers of innocent people, including children, in those utterly poor third world countries?

You're devotion to such a murderous organization and the involuntary "union" that forces peaceful people to fund this violent institution. This institution is founded on violence, and that's all you're glorifying.

likeAustralia
likeAustralia like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Funny. The previous article/page that I was just on (Human Beings Are Getting Dumber, Says Study) .."Recommended" this article next.

JenEliz
JenEliz

The States created the Government.  The Government did not create the States! D.C. is not a State!  Without the States what would D.C. be?  Each State has its own military, Guard, police, constitution, laws, commerce,  etc...   I love this great Nation called America and I will defend it against all enemies.  Outside and within!

BIGSYKO
BIGSYKO like.author.displayName 1 Like

Who really cares if they leave? And this talk of "over 1million supporters"? There are over 300 million people in this great country of ours. And I'm sorry, but you are definitely not a Patriot if you are spewing this ignorant talk of secession. So leave, who's stopping you? You can get a passport and a plane ticket any day of the week. Leave the business of grown ups to the rest of us and take your ball & go home.

Fla4Me
Fla4Me like.author.displayName 1 Like

Just self deport already...  We had an election.  You lost.  Now run along...

RobertWilliamGeiserIII
RobertWilliamGeiserIII

It is with out doubt, that our government has drifted FAR from it's routes over the past 100 or so years, and now represents the very thing that we seceded from originally in 1776. We, the American people, need to revisit our routes and purge our authoritarian federal government, in pursuit of freedom, liberty, and justice. I have links to all 50 states petitions, and most of their duplicates here:stevemeadedesigns(dot)com/board/topic/155641-individuals-from-all-50-states-start-petitions-to-the-white-house-asking-for-a-peaceful-secession-from-the-us/This is a historical movement that now has over a MILLION supporters. Do what's right, America. Let's get our freedom back!

JoyceSobeckyBarron
JoyceSobeckyBarron

I am being told I am selfish, that delaware wasn't hit, I should continue on with my duties as a citizen, learn how fema works. I have asked for help from 400 sources in addition to fema and know how they work because my husband has risked his life for decades responding to disasters. In my part of delaware I can see new jersey lights from my yard and we did get about 250,000in damage. Before this we were on track to create dozens of jobs in a depressed county next year. Continued in reply

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@ewephoriayarns Wow, and you call me a "a one-dimensional hater" IF that ain't hypocrytical!! But that is typical of "enlightened" leftists - you're comments do not reflect those of a liberal thinker.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot like.author.displayName 1 Like

First, I do not support secession. The republic is still "functioning."  Now - The ONLY reason Austin is successful is that it is in a conservative state into which businesses are moving generating revenue to pay their debauchery and leaching habits just like Dallas and Houston. Let’s consider California. The fifth largest economy in the world and they are bankrupt. Why - democrat led house and now the Dems control all decisions coming out of Sacramento. That would be the future of Austin. Civil, religious, and political freedoms? Are you kidding me -the only freedoms being suppresses in Austin are conservative values. Do the research and it will be very apparent that the only reason blue states have income is because of the conservatives within the states. The blue win the cities where there exist the majority of debauched leaches. Interesting that leftists - they are not liberal - want to strip a US citizen of their citizenship for peacefully petitioning the government which is their Right but have no problem giving citizenship to illegal immigrants who tend to be leaches on our State's revenue. I visited East Germany and Communist Poland (how many reading this even remember there was an East Germany? I have seen with my own eyes the results of leftist politics. I will fight to keep our nation prosperous.

NwD
NwD

@ProudPatriot I'd also like to add, that these subsidies, help keep those low taxes in the red states, low.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@NwD @ProudPatriot thanks for the website - now the real research has to begin.  You see, differences sources stating different things.  NOW - we move onto other sources which explain more.  Those are not subisidies flowing into the states.  That is pay checks to Military personnel which Texas conservative states tend to have a lot of.  Many retirees - civilian and military stay in the wamer states. Not Cali - because it is REALLY expensive.  When talking straight up subisidies the numbers look mighty different. Glad you are on top of things.

NwD
NwD

@ProudPatriot Where are you getting the info about TX distribution?  Is there a relevant link within nemw.org you could share?

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@NwD @ProudPatriot Thank-you.  Now ask yourelf.  What areas in those states tend to exhibit the irresponisble behavior.  I can tell you that for TX, it is Dallas, Houston, San Antonio, and El Paso.  Now, look at the areas in TX that were Blue.  Gee.  You see, they only use the portion they want to "prove" their point, but digging deeper, you find their point may be invalid. here is a nice website though for fiscal distribution - www.nemw.org . The info is dated but does a decent job at explaining how the money is distributed. Obviously, those states with more Federal interests will receive more federal dollars.

NwD
NwD

@ProudPatriot ProudPatriot I'm sorry, but you have absolutely no clue on why California is in a budget crisis. I love how mention one "blue" state as an example that is applied universally. But nice try on trying to sound informed. Additionally, one of California's big budgetary problems is that it couldn't raise taxes and thus the crisis has been prolonged. It's terrible having your college education compromised because the state can't raise money to maintain, much less improve the quality and access to secondary education. You might also be interested to know that republican states were net recipients of Federal subsidies, while the blue states are net payers. In other words, blue states are assisting red states.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@NwD @ProudPatriot Not exxactly accurate.  Hey, maybe you could have had money for college if the state did not have to doll out the welfare costs (http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/jul/28/welfare-capital-of-the-us/).  And about that Blue subsidizing Red well a huffington post linked article would disagree ( http://247wallst.com/2012/08/03/states-that-get-the-most-federal-money/) but hey, why let information get in the way of a good opinion.  Fun in the SUN! that is what I am talking about!!

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@ProudPatriot Your name implies support of our American system of government which is a democratic republic.  But your views are those of a right-wing theocratic despot.  That's not American--as evidenced by the recent election.   You think because you got the grand tour of communist Europe, courtesy of the imperial express that makes you an expert on government?  Baloney.  You're just one of the 'low information' one-dimensional haters that just LOST, big time in a national election, despite supposedly representing the "American People."  You represent one thing--   I'm a business owner, and now and  for years have paid plenty of income taxes, and I'm a liberal--not a Democrat, but a liberal.  So there goes your theory.

Umbrella
Umbrella

@ProudPatriot I believe you meant to express your hatred of "debauched leeches", not "debauched leaches"

JohnCloutier
JohnCloutier

A Blue America would dominate a Red America and then we'd  have to listen to them whine!

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@JohnCloutier You have obviously not considered the state of affairs in California? ASk yourself and research, who are the money makers and the money takers in your state.  You will find the makers are the conservatives and the takers are the leftists.  The former Warsaw Pact were all takers.  Greece is made up of taker BTW- our personal individual debt is higher than Greece's.   

DrDavidH.Menke
DrDavidH.Menke like.author.displayName 1 Like

Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state in favor of stripping and deporting those people who peacefully request to secede from the USA,  shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.

JoyceSobeckyBarron
JoyceSobeckyBarron

I'd just be happy if the Obama campaign showed some compassion and caring for people in other states affected by Sandy.  This is one Latino family in Delaware about to lose everything because the federal FEMA system of disaster aid doesn't work.  Also, if the disability community had less than 28% unemployment despite his fancy page on whitehouse.gov, or if it took less than an average of three years to be approved for Social Security disability benefits.  We have tried for over 2-1/2 weeks to get help for our small business ravaged by Sandy in Delaware with 0 responses from anyone, despite reaching out to over 400 different sources.  So tell me again why I should continue to pay taxes in a country that doesn't recognize we exist

pstevens2402
pstevens2402

There is no FEMA aide being offered to indivduals or households, and I'm assuming business. The only aid in the state of DE is for is to state and local governements for emergency work and repair of facilities damaged by the disaster. Perhaps before you say it does not work...you should look into how its supposed to work.  I live in the state of DE, and I have to say we got off lightly compared to NY and NJ 

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@JoyceSobeckyBarron I'm very sorry that people are still waiting for help from the hurricane.  I've donated to worthy private relief funds, and hope the best for all those affected.  If there were something I could do personally, I'd be willing to give it a go.    As for the rest--yes FEMA is inefficient;  would it be better under a GOP administration that wants to abolish it?  Yes, Social Security Disability is slow.  Will it be better if we disband it altogether, as GOP wishes to do?  And as to why we're paying taxes, well, I'm a bit at a loss on that one. 

last.brunneng
last.brunneng

@JoyceSobeckyBarron You should continue all your duties as a citizen because your government has done more for you than just what you count in the last two weeks. You're using the Internet, thank the government; I'm sure at some point today you stepped foot on a road or sidewalk, thank the government. Just try to imagine what state your community would be in if it had no federal assistance whatsoever, you can use the luxury of your Internet service to see how the haitians are doing.

kasey.s.brown
kasey.s.brown

@last.brunneng  @last.brunneng The government does not provide the internet.  Privately owned ISPs do.  The government also did not maintain the road and sidewalk just for him - they have to do that for everyone.  No federal assistance would mean that state and privately owned assistance would take up the role.I like the tactic of bringing up the worst places in the world, as if absolutely horrible treatment elsewhere automatically justifies slightly less horrible treatment here.

last.brunneng
last.brunneng

@kasey.s.brown The federal government funded the expansion of the Internet and regulates the private industry; a sidewalk doesn't need to be built for a specific person to be appreciated, that's a government service that would not exist without the government. And yes, Haiti is a reference point to what life could be like without a strong government, which is exactly what the OP was trying to denigrate. I was trying to point out that this person who is "about to lose everything" has plenty more to lose if the government didn't exist.

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

Oh please, please, please...can't we let them?  Half a million, or so, fewer right-wing reactionaries...Imagine there's a heaven...

formerlyjames
formerlyjames

@ewephoriayarns No, we can't let them because they represent a small deranged population in each of their states, even the most red one such as Texas.  These lunatics are best ignored or jailed if they resort to violence, which is possible.

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@formerlyjames @ewephoriayarns  Oh, I intending the whole state--because they're clearly the small minority--Half a million isn't even a majority in one of the smaller states they come from.  I thought maybe they could all go to one place and make their conservative haven, and leave the rest of us alone.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@ewephoriayarns you obviously have no recollection of the fomer Warsaw Pact and the conditions which existed there.  I was there and saw the conditions with my own eyes.  That is your idea of heaven? - go to Cuba. I did not serve over 20 years in the US military fighting defending against leftism to hand it over.  I also will defend the US Constitution (NOT a UN resolution) against all enemies foreign and domestic - including those sitting in DC.

URAFOOL
URAFOOL

You obviously are NOT aware of the Sedition Acts passed by the Founding Fathers in 1795.  1795.  Did I mention they were passed into law by the Founding Fathers in 1795??  After the Whiskey Rebellion.  Not allowed to take up arms against the government.  Must be changed via elections, legislation, and ammendments.  If you take up arms against the government, can be tried by a military tribunal.  Considered SEDITION (treason).  Good luck in Guantanomo Bay.

Mr.357
Mr.357

@URAFOOL Not a bad defense but unfortunately the Sedition Acts only outlaw acts that are seen as "treason" which by the constitution are desribed in Article III Section 3 as "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted."  I agree Secession is an idiotic idea, but the Sedition Acts didn't outlaw it.

URAFOOL
URAFOOL

Sorry.  It also falls under the "Militia Law" of 1792, utilized by non other than The main Founding Father, George Washington himself.

This was the first use of the Militia Law of 1792

setting a precedent for the use of the militia to "execute the laws ofthe union, (and) suppress insurrections," asserting the right of thenational government to enforce order in one state with troops raised inother states.

 http://www.earlyamerica.com/earlyamerica/milestones/whiskey/

Hope you find Guantanamo comfy   :)

URAFOOL
URAFOOL

@ProudPatriot @ewephoriayarns     You, obviously, are NOT aware of the Sedition Acts of 1795.    1795.  Did I mention the year was 1795?  That means IT WAS THE FOUNDING FATHERS, after the Whiskey Rebellion.  Good luck in jail.

formerlyjames
formerlyjames

@ProudPatriot @ewephoriayarns  "Patriot", you have a very warped and seditious view of the role of our military.  I served as well, and support our troops when they understand that role, which you obviously don't.  We can do without such self-acclaimed "patriots" as you.

formerlyjames
formerlyjames

@ProudPatriot   I won't intrude on your own version of history written only in your mind, but I offer this.  Those communists of the Soviet Union, won the war against those Nazi "socialists".  How you reconcile this with your version, I can't imagine.  You owe your freedom and survival from your German "socialists" to Russia.  It was their gift to you at the cost of 23 million lives.  

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@formerlyjames @ProudPatriot apparently I am.  Try studying history and not just the cliff notes. The only reason they were anti-communists is because communism was looking really good to many of the German people and they would have stolen votes from the German Workers Pary i.e. Socialist i.e. left wing. Show the communist in a bad light, you get the votes. It is not too hard to comprehend.  Our policticians do it to a much lesser degree in the primaries.  NAZIs had a socialist platform and their actions were Socialist in the sense of everything belongs to the State.  It is not what is taught in the left-leaning education establishment but then again they also do not teach about Black slave owners like William Ellison, or Egenices of Margret Sanger, or LBJs comments about blacks in the South.  Nope, cannot bring those up. I am glad you are so enlightened.

formerlyjames
formerlyjames

@ProudPatriot  For starters, our military is controlled by democratically selected civilians, who you imply are "enemies" sitting in DC.  Other than that, you are beyond "enlightenment".  You are severely ignorant of history.  Above, you equate the Third Reich with current leftists.  What the National Socialist Workers Party in Germany began as, and what it became, extreme right wing anti-communist, are miles apart.  Your analogy is ludicrous and laughable in the jr. high history class.  You are not worth my time, clown.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@formerlyjames @ProudPatriot @ewephoriayarns interesting - so what is the role of our military?  Please, enlighten me oh wise one.  Your arrogance needs to be backed up with explanation otherwise it is nothing more than a baseless emotional outburst - typical of leftist though.

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@ProudPatriot @ewephoriayarns I see.  So you're clearly willing to impose your views on the majority who voted for the current administration.  I think in Warsaw Pact land, and Cuba, they called that dictatorship--didn't they?

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@NwD @ProudPatriot They have had it since 1775 - who motivated the people to rebell in our Revolutionary War. Preamble of the Constitution states that is the reason for the government - look out for the general welfare of the people - not provide, mind you.  However, our history is wrought with corporate influence in government.

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@ProudPatriot state control is a characteristic of both far left (communist) and far right (fascist) political stances.  Nazis were not and are not Leftist.   And that is found in numerous sources that have nothing to do with US education. 

NwD
NwD

@ProudPatriot Nothing will erode our rights faster than corporations gaining power over the government.

NwD
NwD

@ProudPatriot But you realize many conservative governments also commit reprehensible acts. You're talking about extremes. 

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@formerlyjames @kasey.s.brown @ProudPatriot wrong again!! your are batting 0-2! Keep up the insults, it proves my point.  Attack the person not the information. Nazi had state control over practically everything, that is "Socialism;" Socialism is Left.  Pretty simple actually, unless of course your are left, and are astonished that anyone could ever make such an obvious observation. But hey, I too was misled at our US Secondary education and only when I wrote papers on the subject did it ocurr to me, I was lied to ... about a lot of things.  Research is great, you never know what you will uncover. Cheers.

formerlyjames
formerlyjames

@kasey.s.brown @ProudPatriot  Give up.  The ProudPatriot is probably a grade school drop out who has no grasp of history.  I too was stunned with the Nazi drivel.  It is an idiot.  No clue.

kasey.s.brown
kasey.s.brown

@ProudPatriot I have no idea where to even BEGIN correcting you, but the nazis were FASCIST.  They were extreme rightest, and believed in established social classes, as opposed to the left which believes there should be no classes.  Hitler believed in statism and state-corporatism, which is the exact opposite of the left.  I'm not even going to bother correcting you further.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@ewephoriayarns @ProudPatriot Majority disagreed with Bonhoeffer too. Does not make them right. The leftist won the cities where the majority are takers.  Americans do not know history - I saw personally the effects of leftist governments in the former Warsaw Pact.  we have forgotten the misery under which they lived. I refuse to sit back and watch it happen; especially as long as we have a republican form of government - but that will not last long -  “Tyrants have always some slight shade of virtue; they support the laws before destroying them” - Voltaire

ewephoriayarns
ewephoriayarns

@ProudPatriot good for you.  You made your selection and a majority disagreed with you.  It's called a system of government.  Now, if you want to give corporate welfare, you can go to Walmart and pay some extra for your toothpaste.

ProudPatriot
ProudPatriot

@ewephoriayarns @ProudPatriot you really read into that.  Off the cuff comments typically miss the point. I will defend this Republic from leftist - yes.  The Germans voted in a leftist dictator (NAZIs were Socialist e.g. left politics BTW - they were also mostly occultists) because he said all the right things,  promised all the right things, and blamed those nasty corpporations and rich people. Matter of fact that was Lenins platform too - look how that turned out for them.  But hey - why learn from history!? we never seeem to.  Corporate Welfare --> job creation; Social Welfare --> national bankrupcy.  I pick the former.